A Chat with Morgana O'Reilly, the Breakout Star of 'The White Lotus' Season 3

How wonderful for us!

“Pam, you seem great, you’re a terrific person.” 

— Timothy Ratliff, ‘The White Lotus’ Season 3, Episode 1

“How wonderful for you. How wonderful for you.” In that moment, a star not dissimilar to Ally Maine was born and her name was Pam (no last name). She might not be fucking her guests like Valentin or ignoring their legitimate pleas to be protected from a murderer like Fabian, but when it comes to charisma, uniqueness, nerve and talent, not since Valentina has a White Lotus staffer conjured such immediate adoration. Though her screen time is limited, Pam, played by actress Morgana O'Reilly, steals focus at every turn.

Pam is motivated by one thing only: Ensuring the Ratliff family adheres to the hotel’s efforts toward a digital detox. She wants them to focus on being present, doing self care and biometrics tests and warns them against snacking on fruit from the mighty pong-pong trees that loom over their villa. By Episode 2, she’s already “killing it,” according to patriarch Timothy after she adheres to his request to not schedule any activities for him. Things take a turn in Episode 3 when she brings a blender to the villa for Saxon. Timothy, with his world beginning to close in on him, suggests the family give all of their electronics to Pam. “No! Pam, my ass,” Saxon responds.

She’s downtrodden but surely used to it. By Episode 4, she’s taking it, too, from Timothy, who’s swerved from his previous position and is now taking a more Saxon-esque approach in dealing with Pam, which is to say dismissing her already limited power.

It’s not a particularly heroic arc and in less capable hands it might be described even as unmemorable, but thanks to O’Reilly’s performance, Pam has become a fan favorite, even evoking what’s known as the #PamFam, a subset of the fandom who recognize the queen within. Respecting royalty, I decided to seek out O’Reilly, a New Zealand-born actress who was up to now best known for her role as Naomi Canning in Neighbours but can now put the feather in her cap that is being one of the breakout stars of the most popular show on television. Below, our chat.

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Obviously, there are a lot of breakout stars and moments in the White Lotus “cinematic universe,” but you burn very bright among them. I’d love to start off by talking about your casting and how the character of Pam was first presented to you.

It was really straightforward! I'm not used to things being so straightforward; there's usually back and forth, back and forth. I got an audition and I signed an NDA and I sent it back in to my agent, who came back and said, “I've never seen an NDA come back so fast” and I was like, “Well, come on!” [Laughs] I got a script — a scene or two, no context, no idea of how big the character was or anything like that, but I knew she was staff and I thought a lot about how in the first two seasons, the staff in The White Lotus often have a very civil veneer firmly placed over some kind of manic tension underneath, so I thought I would bring that to her. So I sent in the self-tape, had a good time and off it went. I didn't think anything more of it. Then I was at a friend's wedding two weeks later and I got a lovely text from my agent saying, “We just got this amazing feedback from casting of White Lotus. They really liked you!” and I was like, “Oh my gosh. Stop the wedding!” [Laughs] No, I just thought, “Well, that'll do me. I will dine on that for years to know that somebody watched it, they liked it, they said it.” Then two weeks after that, we had another update that there was still strong interest and that Mike [White] doesn't really do callbacks and that we should hear in the next few days, so I just got to sit and hope for this. I didn't have to sit in turmoil. Then the next morning at 7 a.m., I got a call from my agent saying I got it and I said, “Are you sure?”

So you are a Kiwi, but your character is Australian. Was the part of Pam written to be Australian and if so, did you have any understanding as to why an Australian would end up at the White Lotus Thailand?

So when the audition came, she was an Australian character. When I got the part and I had a quick meeting with Mike, I said to him, “Would you consider making her a Kiwi? It's much more niche and you haven't had a Kiwi in the show before, whereas you have had an Australian.” And he just went, “Oh sure! Do whatever you like.” I was like, “You don't know how big this is!” It's like saying, “Should they be Canadian or American?” To outside ears, it all sounds the same. But I just stupidly pained myself over it for weeks. I tried to strongarm her into being a Kiwi and I would do little bits for friends and be like, “What do you think is funnier? This or this?” and they would all be like, “Australian’s funnier.” I also don't feel like New Zealand has that same high-end wellness like Australia does — that condescending wellness. [Laughs]

So you had the opportunity to bring your own Kiwi representation and you opted out!

I opted out! I opted to take the piss out of Australians. Sorry Australia!

Can you talk about meeting with Mike? It's been my understanding from conversations with cast members that Mike’s not really big on talking about the character or answering lots of questions. I'm curious what your experience was.

I can see now why he has a show like he has because he loves actors and he loves a performer. He loves somebody to come to the table with quirks, idiosyncrasies, all these little things. Sometimes you can work with a director who — and it's not to say one is right or wrong — but that has a really clear idea of the way it needs to be played and even said sometimes with intonation, which is really annoying! I don't respond well to that kind of direction, but he was really up for chatting about anything and as soon as we started talking, I definitely got the feeling that he was just like, “Do whatever. Don't bother me with it. Just come to the table with something and it better be good.” And he did say — and it was basically the nicest thing anyone in his position could ever say to an actor — which is: “You look completely different to how I imagine this character, but your audition was so great I wanted you,” and I thought that’s the nicest thing because usually it's the other way around: You were great, you just don’t look quite right. You don't like this person's sister or that person's friend. It always comes down to how you look, and so for that to be off the table and to have overrated that with what I was capable of was really nice.

What do you make of Pam's feelings on the Ratliff family? In your mind, are they par for the course in terms of the kind of characters she often encounters working at the White Lotus or did they have more… eccentricities?

I think it's such an interesting thing for her. She works in this wellness space. She works in hotels all over the place. I felt like she probably transfers around Thailand, around southeast Asia and Australasia a fair amount. I feel like Pam is always in internal conflict with her own demons. In my backstory for her — which I wish you got to see in the series — she fucks off to Bangkok every now and then and disappears for like three days and everyone can’t get a hold of Pam and she's lost and she's like totally off the wagon, and then she pulls herself back together and she's determined and she's always got a new health fad and she's always into it. So she is a great believer in the gospel that she spits, but she also can't quite practice what she preaches all the time, so she's in conflict with that. And then I think with her clients, she feels like there's a real possibility if they just do this and that, they really could find redemption — but that's coming from somebody who's struggling. [Laughs] So that's where I was pitching her. I think everybody that she deals with tests her and increment by increment, pushes her to a major bender in Bangkok. [Laughs] 

Love that! Of the fellow White Lotus staffers that we meet (Gaitok, Mook, Valentin, etc.), who do you think that Pam is closest with?

I feel like she gets on it with Valentin and the boys from time to time, and then tries to be like, “No! Amrita, let's do a session. Can we just have a big detox weekend just us?” [Laughs] I think she's a little bit weary of Fabian. I reckon she's worried he can see right through her.

What do you think about Pam's relationship with Timothy? There's that scene when he first approaches her wanting his phone back, and she's physically quite afraid of him but there's an interesting power dynamic in that Pam has a power over him. She literally is the crux of him having access to his world, something he’s in turn trying to escape at the moment.

I think she has this philosophy that she really thinks is gonna be the key to most people's happiness and she really wants to believe in it — I mean heck, I believe it. I took my phone out of my room to charge at night and I am so righteous about myself. [Laughs] I think she is like that too. But when he looks at her with those steely cold blue eyes, he's really scary, but she has a job to do, so she's in conflict. I don't know if she knows more.

One of the first viral moments to emerge out of this season was your iconic, “How wonderful for you. How wonderful for you.” I'm wondering what it was like for you as an actor to see what I think could have been a throwaway moment become Internet gold. I think that’s one of the great things about The White Lotus: It has all of these moments that seemingly might mean nothing in the context of the show, but are picked up and received by this rabid fan base as nuggets of iconography.

Throughout my career, the thing that I've always loved is being that smaller role that everybody remembers — that will always be what I will go for — so it was amazing. We watched the first episode at the premiere and that just made me so proud that she just got a big laugh because I'm aware that I'm coming out of the blue for the American audience. Going up to the premiere especially, I was really preparing to feel like I didn't care if people didn’t want photos of me. So after that first episode played for everybody and we're at the premiere and then people were like, “Oh, you were great!” I felt like, “See! See! I'm here. I'm in it.” 

What has it been like for you to see the character of Pam received so lovingly online — particularly from the gays, myself among them. To your point, she is a smaller character, but I think she means something to all of us. I think there's a way in which a lot of people relate to Pam and I think that there's been a built out lore about who Pam is. What has it been like for you as an actor to see this character become such a prominent figure on social media?

Oh, my gosh. I am thrilled! Thank goodness. [Laughs] To be embraced by the gays is the biggest honor because it is a true recognition of one's wit and charisma, uniqueness, nerve and talent, so that's been so great. I can't quite believe it because I get sent the odd bits and bobs, which is so nice and then sometimes I look but I’m like, “Don't look too far, Morgs! You might see something that you don't like.” [Laughs]

Part of the unique process of the show is that it films for quite a long time, you all are living together on this campus of sorts and it’s very different than your standard production. What was it like immersing yourself in this world and with this cast?

I remember rocking up to Koh Samui and being a nobody, knowing who everybody else was and having nobody know me. That’s quite confronting. This is all dialogue that's happening in my head at the time. I had traveled all over the world, backpacked through South America on my own and so I'm actually quite good at being alone traveling to another country, but I hadn't done it in that level of opulence with all those famous people, so at first I had to go, “Just think of it like you’re traveling. As soon as you get on set, they'll understand where you sit in the ecosystem,” which was totally the case. My first day on set was that scene outside with the pong-pong tree, and Parker [Posey] was amazing. I think she saw a fellow comedic actress in me and we had a lot of fun. When I found out Parker was in the show, I fucking cried. That day, I remember feeling like if nothing else, I've just got to watch her work and that has been such a joy. She is genuinely so funny and so great. I think most people know that feeling of working with somebody they admire and them not quite living up to your expectation, but that was not the case with Parker. Between takes, we’d sit and chat and she took my number because she was also all over where to get a massage and I was like, “You have to tell me!” So she wrote down all these places and gave me that piece of paper and I'm never gonna get rid of this piece of paper! Then she took my number and at the end of the day, I messaged her to say, “Thank you for being so lovely,” and she messaged me back saying, “What you did wasn’t easy. You came in, you smashed it, you're awesome, let's hang out!” So that felt like a lovely welcoming into the coven and then by the end of it, by the last chapter, I really felt like these are my castmates, these are my friends, I know the situation and I'm a part of it, so it was a really good journey from one end of imposter syndrome to not feeling that. 

Now that you're watching the show, is there a particular storyline, scene or performance that you as a consumer of media — not as an actor — find yourself really drawn to that is unexpected for you?

There are so many sequences that when I was reading them, I couldn't wait to see, like the cobra sequence with Walton! I’m terrified of snakes, as he is too, and I just would really have to have a conversation with myself if I had to do that. And I just loved that whole sequence. It made me laugh, made me squeal. And then of course, the Sam Rockwell monologue was so amazing. When we were on set, there were rumors of one actor doing it and then there were rumors of Sam Rockwell doing it, who was one of my favorite actors in the world, but then I left it and I forgot about it. So when I was watching that episode, I was so enthralled with the story by that point, and then I realized that was coming up and I was sitting there going, “Oh my God, oh my God, who's it gonna be?” and he came on and it was so great.

What has it been like for you watching the reception to Season 3 and the way in which this fandom can’t stop discussing, dissecting, speculating and obsessing over this show?

The amount of talent that comes on this show — Mike [White] is a fucking genius and he brings geniuses into his sphere. The editing, the music, the visual effects, the costume, the makeup, all of it comes together and there's just this delicious, delicious feast, so even though I know things, it's still a thrill to watch it. It forms something so much more whole. It’s the exact opposite of reading a book and then watching the film where it completely disappoints. For this, I've read the script and then I am going to watch the show and it completely fills in all the nooks and crannies and that's amazing. It’s incredible to see this kind of cultural juggernaut just roll through the Internet. I love the week by week format; it's so vintage! Everyone's like, “Oh God, I have to wait for another week!” 

I've been thinking about what would’ve happened if Pam had been responsible for Tanya at the White Lotus in Maui or Sicily. Who do you think would have been more difficult for Pam to have the reins on: the Ratliff family or Tanya?

I feel like she might enable Tanya in a really destructive way and likewise, I think Tanya would have eaten her alive. I think she could have been the end of Pam! [Laughs]

If you had the final say of where Season 4 of The White Lotus would be set, where would you want it to be?

That’s such a hard one. Do we want snow? 

There's been talk of snow, but the difficult thing is — and you know this better than anyone — filming for six or seven months in the snow is tough to pull off.

You're so right! When I'm asked that question, lots of things go through my head: Where would you like to be on a really selfish level? Oh, Europe! It’s gorgeous. Come on! But they've done that. We haven't seen something like snow, but every season has had that oceanside setting, and each season they’ve had that amazing shot that they get from the ocean's point of view looking at the resort and it's all turgid and has this incredible feeling of the natural grandness of the ocean just watching the frivolity of human behavior. It’s delicious! So I feel like running with that, it needs to be oceanside again somewhere. Or maybe Morocco or something could be amazing.

If you were to overall summarize what this experience was like for you, how do you look back at it now with time and retrospect? What does all of this mean to you?

I think it's like a fairy tale because all the way along, it's actually gone really smoothly and positively. There's been plenty of anxiety about it at every point from production to screening. The world could have been really mean to me, I could have felt like shit at the premiere, but all of it has been so delightful and a thing of teenage fantasy — me laying in bed going, “This is what I want my future to be like.”